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Comment: libhtml-wikiconverter-moinmoin-perl is cool
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Hallo FranklinPiat, @"I want a better documentation of Debian and Debian software in this wiki". I'm especially talking about this wiki here. If you compare the German section of this wiki here to wiki.ubuntuusers.de then what you can find here is pretty poor. I think Debian should have a similiar wiki, too, although most Debian users are more experienced than Ubuntu users and don't need that much help. There is already good help on the net like http://www.debiananwenderhandbuch.de but that's not a wiki and therefore it is not easy to contribute to it. Also it has a strict structure. I already realized the problem, that we also have a documentation for each package at packages.debian.org and a readme file, that comes with the package and so forth. So we'd actually be duplicating that here in the wiki. "The right place for documenting a software is with the package" So my question is: What do we want to do at the Wiki ? It would be nice if there was a function, that could automatically load a package's description into a wiki page. We could then write further information around it. Is there a mailing list or a communication area for the wiki ? "If you can write perl, you might want to help improving packages.debian.org" I probably could, I have been writing PHP for years. Best wishes from Germany Zikzag --- Zikzag, 2009-02-08 16:54 |
?TableOfContents(3)
Debian Wiki
Are you Mad at me ? If you got mad because of some "clean-up" i have made, please :
Undo and do how you feel it would be the best for wiki.debian.org.
Forgive me. I am not doing it because it's funny (trust me, it isn't funny to spend hours removing or merging pages). I'am not willing to bother people (I know that some people spent quite some time writing those pages).
- Read more below to understand why i am doing this.
Some ideas about what Debian Wiki is :
Focus on what's useful to Debian - is the page useful ? is the page related to debian ?
Some ideas about what Debian Wiki isn't:
wiki.d.o isn't www.debian.org/doc/ - avoid duplicating the official documentation
wiki.d.o isn't packages.debian.org - don't just duplicate package description and meta-data here.
wiki.d.o isn't a manpages repository. - don't just duplicate a manpage here
wiki.d.o isn't wikipedia - link to wikipedia, rather duplicating content here (especially for non-debian specific)
wiki.d.o isn't dictionary - don't create a page to merely define a term. link to online dictionary if needed.
wiki.d.o isn't jargon file - same as dictionary and wikipedia above.
Some best practice for wiki editors :
less is more : Perfection is not when there is nothing to add, but when there is nothing to remove. (Antoine de Saint-Exupery). To put it another way, Once you have finished to write a page, it's time to consider to make it shorter
Obsolete content should be 1)Updated 2) Deleted ... or exceptionally, 3)Preserved for Historical purposed (and marked as such). note: oldstable isn't obsolete content, it IS current.
- Subscribe to the page you are interested in.
- recommend the use of proper terms (X11, XWindow and Xorg aren't interchangeable words..)
?Anchor(hints)
Hints and tips
Here's the top ten things I do on a system (user preferences):
- Edit ~/.bashrc
Enable export LS_OPTIONS='--color=auto' ; eval "`dircolors`" ; alias ls='ls $LS_OPTIONS'
Enable shell completion, by appending source /etc/bash_completion
Install vim-nox, then enable various options in /etc/vim/vimrc (especially set incsearch, syntax on, and set ignorecase. see my attachment:.vimrc).
Install mc, screen, tree, xnest, fast-user-switch-applet
Enable default saved in /boot/grub/menu.lst
Install some mozilla's : [http://chrispederick.com/work/web-developer/ web-developer]
and some system hints
?Anchor(log)
My log on the Wiki
Here's a very incomplete log of my activities on this wiki :
- 2009-01-17
Cleanup (CategoryProposedDeletion).
- 2009-01-17
Proposing a structure for CategoryProprietarySoftware (on [http://lists.debian.org/debian-www/2009/01/msg00135.html debian-www]).
- 2009-01-15
[http://lists.debian.org/debian-release/2009/01/msg00335.html testing-proposed-updates] patch to fix 510012 .
- 2009-01-12
research to embed images.. which lad to [wiki:DebianWiki/EditorGuide DebianWiki/EditorGuide#screenshots]
- 2009-01-12
[http://lists.debian.org/debian-release/2009/01/msg00288.html stable-proposed-updates] to fix 511416 and 504562 2009-01-11 :: Create ["DiscussionsAfterLenny/Sections"].
- 2009-01-01
Major rewrite of ["WindowsEquivalent"].
- 2009-01-08
- Major rewrite of |"tasksel"], ["Gnome"] and ["KDE"]
- 2009-01-04
- New wiki maintenance/monitoring scripts.
- 2009-01-04
- Cleanup old discussions pages
- 2009-01-04
Start preparing [:MigrationStatus: Migration to Lenny's moin 1.7].
- 2009-01-03
New ["VersionControlSystem"], and celanup/rewrite/refactor related pages (["git"], ["SVN"]...)
- 2008-12-14
["DebConf9"] dates are confirmed
- 2008-12-04
- Major rewrite of ["EtchAndAHalf"].
- 2008-11-25
- Create ["Debian Wiki/History"].
- 2008-11-01
- Cleanup 2008-08-05 ~ 2008-10-24.
- 2008-10-29
- Create ["Firmware"] page.
- 2008-10-28
Create ["WiFi/HowToUse"] page.
- 2008-10-19
- Create ["InstallingDebianOn/Thinkpad/T60/lenny"] page.
- 2008-10-19
- Create ["Kernel/Oops"] page.
- 2008-09-13
- Clean-up dozens of pages related to the kernel.
- 2008-09-13
- Create/Refactor ["Modules"] page.
- 2008-09-01
- create ["Schedule"] page.
- 2008-09-01
Create ["NewInSqueeze"]
- 2008-08-25
- Cleanup lots of dummy pages related to packaging.
- 2008-07-16
- ["Rsyslog"] start user point of view.
- 2008-07-15
- create ["keyring.debian.org"] (page).
- 2008-07-14
- Templates page cleanup (delete, sync, align to policy...).
Cleanup virtualisation pages (["SystemVirtualization"], ["QEMU"], ["VirtualBox"], ["?Win4Lin"], ["VMware"], ["?LinuxVserver"])
- 2008-07-13
- Create Windows Server Hyper V
- Update ["InstallingDebianOn/VMs/MicrosoftVirtualPc2007/etch"]
- 2008-07-06
cleanup ["FrontPage"]s (fix links...)
- 2008-06-27
create ["AptProtocol"]
- 2008-06-24
create ["MoinMoin/GeneratePdf"]
- 2008-06-22
(re-)create ["NewInEtch"]
- 2008-06-17
add Debian Installer GUI [:ScreenShots#debian-instsaller-gui:ScreenShots]
- 2008-06-03
create/reorganiseg [:M68k:M68k/*] page (see [http://lists.debian.org/debian-68k/2008/06/msg00001.html] debian-68k)
- 2008-05-31
create ["LennyReleaseRecertificationSummary"].
- 2008-05-19
Improve ["?DebianLive/HowTo/SmallSizeImage"].
- 2008-05-12
- create ["sky2"] module page.
- 2008-05-07
create ["pkg/README.?DebianHeader"], ["pkg/README.?DebianTemplate"]
- 2008-05-06
- Update ["DeviceDatabase/USB"], and ["DeviceDatabase/PCI"]
- 2008-05-05
Improve ["ModulesAll"] (actually list all modules ! ).
- 2008-05-03
- create ["Tftp"] page.
- 2008-05-01
multiple ["NewInLenny"] contributions.
- 2008-04-18
- create ["Hibernation"] page.
- 2008-04-05
create ["StableProposedUpdates"]
- 2008-04-06
create ["Linda"] is gone page. + cleanup references to linda.
- 2008-02-27
The very old, and very duplicate wiki structure "DebianWikiTopics" is now gone. Champagne !
- 2008-02-26
- Migrate DebConf/* pages to wiki.debconf.org.
- 2008-02-22
- ["DebianHosting/Dedibox"]
- 2008-02-22
- Migrate !DebianWiki/* Discussion to debian-www mailing list.
- 2008-02-22
- ["DebianHosting/Ovh/RPS"]
- 2008-01-27
Ask improvements to manpages.debian.net (supporting, http://manpages.debian.net/man/1/bash syntax )
- 2008-01-27
- create ["DEHS"].
- 2008-01-23
- create ["Grub/Grub2"] pages.
- 2008-01-13
- create ["Grub/SplashImage"]
- 2008-01-13
ModulesAll, major improvement.
- 2008-01-10
- '07 Q4 cleanup.
- 2008-01-07
- create ["DebianWiki/Browsing"].
- 2007-12-30
- create ["Opera"].
- 2007-12-16
- create ["DeviceDatabase/USB"], ["DeviceDatabase/PCI"]
- 2007-12-15
- create ["ipw2200"]
- 2007-12-14
- rewrite ["LSB"]
- 2007-11-24
create DebianWiki/TranslationNamespace.
- 2007-11-21
InstallingDebianOn : Let me write here what I think about my DebianOn initiative on this wiki (since DebConf7, and I talked to Petter Reinholdtsen +talk?FootNote(hardware detection options and solutions) : It's broken by design : It should be in a database ! (i.e queryable ; statistics ; much easier to report with an assistant, etc.)
- 2007-11-17
- create ["iwlwifi"]
- 2007-11-10
create ?DebianLive/HowTo/SmallSizeImage
- 2007-11-01
- create ["iSCSI"], ["iSCSI/iscsitarget"], ["iSCSI/open-iscsi"] pages
- 2007-10-31
create CategoryPermalink, then tagging many pages.
- 2007-10-23
- create ["rt.debian.org"] page
- 2007-10-07
DebianWiki pages started.?BR add GUI to HowToIdentifyADevice/* (thanks to SalokineTerata) ?BR ?DebianWiki/WikiVote page started.
- 2007-09-30
ModuleAssistant / major improvements.
- 2007-09-27
DebianReleases "child" pages are completed (good enough for now, at least).
- 2007-09-18
Howto make a ScreenShots page.
- 2007-09-16
improve and add links to talks for DebConf*
- 2007-09-08
- converted wiki.debian.net links to wiki.debian.org.
- 2007-09-07
cleanup old ?RemoteWikiLinks (DebianPackage, ?DebianPts, ?DebianPackages, bts )
- 2007-08-14
?InstallingEtchStepByStep project started.
- 2007-08-14
- Glossary started.
I stop updating my log, i think you have the idea : I intend to cleanup wiki.d.o !
- 2007-08-08
what about wiki-pages for packages ? looks like duplicate with packages.debian.org to me. (see ?MetaPackages in http://wiki.debian.org/nanos?action=recall&rev=1 )
- 2007-08-07
Merged "From Windows To Debian" and FromWindowsToDebian (plus related cleanup) ?BR Merged *X_Window_System* ?BR Merged *WindowManager* ?BR Merged *Desktop environment*
- 2007-08-06
Prepare the merged ?DotNetFrontPage, ?OldFrontPage to FrontPage
- 2007-08-06
- Major cleanup around "Debian Enterprise" pages.
- 2007-08-05
- 2007-08-05
InterWiki Migration : Cleaning-up "RemoteWikiURL" links from old wiki.d.o (based on kwiki). ?BR RemoteWikiURL were used in http://zwiki.org/ to declare others wiki. (many wiki pages were needed in thoses zwiki days.. deprecated today)
- 2007-06-05
- HowToIdentifyADevice pages started
- 2007-05-28
InstallingDebianOn project started.
?Anchor(new-pages)
New wikipages ideas
A page with samples of Debian fonts. (sample text, use Sample_Font_Displays_In_Other_Languages )
?Anchor(theme)
Theme
Current wiki.d.o layout (theme) isn't very nice, still Moinmoin can be nice. some ideas [http://moinmo.in/ThemeMarket ?ThemeMarket], [http://moinmo.in/MoinMoinScreenShots ScreenShots]:
http://wiki.winehq.org/ (I'm not fan of the colors though)
http://www.handhelds.org/moin/moin.cgi/TitleIndex This one is very clean
http://wiki.ethereal.com/TitleIndex some good ideas here too
More on http://www.google.com/search?q=inurl:TitleIndex+-inurl:trac.
Also, Apache.org is caching their [http://wiki.apache.org/general/ wiki] pages.
My Todo for Debian
- Create a package (à la module-assistant), to deploy private root CAs.
Package http://www.limesurvey.org/
Package https://trac.luffy.cx/wiremaps/ (see lldp )
- Packages Sections
Rename the section perl as perl-lib and python as python-lib.
- Get a separate section for I18n stuffs (especially those that are part of tasks)??
Rewrite DebianWiki Privacy policy, based on http://www.debian.org/MailingLists/
- Consistency in the way "Recommends" are installed: DI don't install "Recommends", but apt-get and aptitude don't.
Document [http://diberri.dyndns.org/wikipedia/html2wiki/index.html html2wiki] and libhtml-wikiconverter-moinmoin-perl somewhere on the wiki
Visitors comments
Hallo FranklinPiat,
@"I want a better documentation of Debian and Debian software in this wiki".
I'm especially talking about this wiki here. If you compare the German section of this wiki here to
wiki.ubuntuusers.de
then what you can find here is pretty poor. I think Debian should have a similiar wiki, too, although most Debian users are more experienced than Ubuntu users and don't need that much help. There is already good help on the net like
http://www.debiananwenderhandbuch.de
but that's not a wiki and therefore it is not easy to contribute to it. Also it has a strict structure.
I already realized the problem, that we also have a documentation for each package at packages.debian.org and a readme file, that comes with the package and so forth. So we'd actually be duplicating that here in the wiki.
"The right place for documenting a software is with the package"
So my question is: What do we want to do at the Wiki ?
It would be nice if there was a function, that could automatically load a package's description into a wiki page. We could then write further information around it.
Is there a mailing list or a communication area for the wiki ?
"If you can write perl, you might want to help improving packages.debian.org"
I probably could, I have been writing PHP for years.
Best wishes from Germany
Zikzag
--- Zikzag, 2009-02-08 16:54
add yours here.