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   1 18:00 -!- pere has changed the topic to Meeting in progress, topic: Who writes the summary and post it to the list?
   2 18:00 < pere> please, everyone, indicate your presence using /me = Full Name
   3 18:00  * pere = Petter Reinholdtsen
   4 18:00 < H> im stil not sure to come to camp
   5 18:01 < pere> so, any volunteer to write the meeting summary?
   6 18:01  * sepski = Ronny Aasen
   7 18:01  * H René Mérou
   8 18:02  * danielsan = Daniel Hess
   9 18:02  * H = René Mérou
  10 18:02  * h01ger = Holger Levsen
  11 18:02 < sepski> I can write the summary
  12 18:02 < pere> sepski: great.  please put your name on the wiki.
  13 18:02 < sepski> done
  14 18:02 -!- pere has changed the topic to Meeting in progress, topic: How do we select arcitectures to release this time? 
  15 18:02 < pere> I placed the topic on the agenda.
  16 18:03  * luk = Luk Claes
  17 18:03 < pere> h01ger and I discussed introducing powerpc to the list of released CD/DVDs yesterday, and I thought it was a good idea to bring up the topic here too.
  18 18:04  * h01ger nods
  19 18:04 -!- h01ger has changed the topic to Meeting in progress, topic: How do we select arcitectures to release this time? | agenda at http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/Meeting 
  20 18:04 < pere> I believe we should be reluctant to add more supported architectures as long as we are short on manpower, and powerpc have only ~1% of the debian population.
  21 18:04 < sepski> if we want to relese non i386 arches then the i386 in cfengine scrips bug should get a higer priority
  22 18:05 < h01ger> sepski, i have those on my radar
  23 18:05 < pere> releasing an amd64 dvd might be an idea, as it has ~10% of the debian population, but I'm not sure if anyone tested it yet.
  24 18:05 < pere> I believe the security team should have their say before new archs are added.
  25 18:05 < h01ger> pere, i'd think we get manpower thru other archs. trying to get powerpc into -edu motivated me a lot to work on -edu, partly because i'm fed up with the climate in debian-powerpc
  26 18:05 < sepski> and amd64 machines can just as easily run the i386 version 
  27 18:06 < pere> what are others view on ths?
  28 18:06  * danielsan is a bit short of time, but generaly could test amd64
  29 18:06 < h01ger> pere, danielsan tests amd64
  30 18:06  * h01ger also asked akai to organize amd64+powerpc machines in trondheim
  31 18:06  * sepski can probably scrunge up a amd64 machine so i may test it too. 
  32 18:07 < pere> I'm not proposing to block porting to powerpc, but would like to see some schools actually requsting it, and now users showing up on popcon.skolelinux.org before we make a powerpc release.
  33 18:07 < pere> those interested in testing it can use the daily built CD.  We might even make a daily built DVD if it make sense.
  34 18:07 < sepski> the porting job would ofcourse continue even it it was not released this time
  35 18:08 < pere> sure
  36 18:08 < h01ger> pere, i think powerpc is basically ready.
  37 18:08 < pere> it helps the quality on i386 and amd64 too when we find porting bugs in the distro.
  38 18:08 < h01ger> the issues i see are related to the fact that the i386 cd is different from the amd64+powerpc cds (netinst, see later topic)
  39 18:09 < h01ger> +i believe..
  40 18:09 < pere> h01ger: yes.  the CDs are a bit different from the DVD.
  41 18:09 < h01ger> pere, no. the i386 cd is different from the other cds.
  42 18:09 < h01ger> different config
  43 18:10 < h01ger> (and yes, the cd is different from the dvd, but i dont mean that)
  44 18:10 < sepski> h01ger, that's my fault im working on making the cd's into netinsts on available time
  45 18:10 < pere> do people agree that we should wait for test reports showing up on popcon.skolelinux.no and schools asking for powerpc version before making a powerpc release?
  46 18:10 < h01ger> sepski, i dont care about fault|blame :)
  47 18:11 < pere> non-i386 archs will need working autobuilders for security fixes, and will increase the need for documentation, and increase the complexity of the documentation.
  48 18:11  * h01ger doesnt. and i only see disk space as a reason not to. and not releasing debian-edu would demotivate me a bit. i'm all in favor of adding a "amd64+powerpc are new and not tested as good as i386" to the release notes
  49 18:12 < sepski> pere, tey wont show on popcon untill they are in use tho. and it might be a selling point to be able to use old macs 
  50 18:13 < h01ger> pere, we have a working amd64 autobuilder and console-tools is not there for amd64, but for powerpc, which has a broken autobuilder atm. but i really think its atm, as this autobuilder is also the volatile+experimental autobuilder... (so i really think it will be fixed soon)
  51 18:13 < pere> sepski: actually, they would show up in any of the powerpc porters ran skolelinux on a powerpc machine. :)
  52 18:13 < pere> s/in/if/
  53 18:13 < sepski> and enabeled popcon :)
  54 18:13 < h01ger> pere, i dont run one for a week, cause i have been testing+reinstalling all the time. but i can stop testing and run the old crap ;-)
  55 18:14 < h01ger> statistics are great and fancy, but not everything
  56 18:15 < pere> sure.  but it backs up my belief and experience, that powerpc users rarely run debian.  they tend to keep their MacOSX-installation.  This make me believe the 0.7% number from ubuntu, and the 1.3% number from debian popcon.
  57 18:16 < pere> we could of course make test releases, and not make final releases unless real users showed up.
  58 18:16 < h01ger> as i said the other day, there were requests for debian-edu on ppc in germany, but we had to say "no, its not yet possible, but we're working on it"
  59 18:16 < pere> we need to move on to the next point.  I notice almost only me and holger have opinions on the topic.
  60 18:16  * h01ger nods
  61 18:16 < sepski> i dont own a ppc :(
  62 18:16 -!- pere has changed the topic to Meeting in progress, topic: Status of the DVD | agenda at http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/Meeting 
  63 18:17 < h01ger> pere, wait a sec. so the conclusion is: include both new archs in the test release and lets see?
  64 18:17 < pere> h01ger: the conclusion is that there is disagreement, and we will have to work some more to find a conclusion, I believe. :)
  65 18:18 < pere> h01ger: (we do not have to make all decisions in this meeting. :)
  66 18:18 < sepski> i think ppc and amd64 machines in trondhime would help the decition making a lot
  67 18:18 < h01ger> akai, ^
  68 18:18 < pere> so, the status of the DVD?  who wants to say something?
  69 18:18 < sepski> From my experience i think the dvd is improving all the time. 
  70 18:18 < sepski> i install a combined server and a ltspserver daily
  71 18:19 < sepski> i rearly test standalone and workstation. 
  72 18:20 < pere> I have similar experience.  I tested main-server today, and found a few problems.
  73 18:20  * h01ger rarely tests the dvd
  74 18:20 < sepski> also getting more of the problems as bugs is a great thing it.  Cheers for h0lger \o/
  75 18:21 < pere> the localization-config package need to be checked, but is actually doing something now.  it configures kdm, but I'm not sure ispell/aspell/myspell is configured properly.
  76 18:21 < h01ger> :) happy to hear that. i was thinking whether you like my "flooding" today or not...
  77 18:22 < sepski> yes it's great, detecting/confirming the bugs are the first step to fixing them 
  78 18:22 < pere> yes, it is great to have bugzillla updated and well kept.
  79 18:23 < h01ger> :) so nothing more about the dvd?
  80 18:23 < sepski> is it just me, or do we have few reports from the test releases ? 
  81 18:23  * pere has introduced a few new packages the last few days, and suspect we will have to modify a few more debian packages to get everything to work properly.  are we fine with this?
  82 18:23  * k4x = Kurt Gramlich
  83 18:24 < pere> for example, I still lack test results from the hotplug fix, and I suspect we will have to modify the udev config to use the atconsole option instead of the plugdev etc groups.
  84 18:24 < h01ger> the test release is some time ago. there are some reports on the german list, and i'm trying to get them into (using) bugzilla. so a test release4 with telling "report bugs now or they wont get fixed"  might be heklpful to get more reports
  85 18:24 < h01ger> hi k4x 
  86 18:25 < sepski> h01ger, or atlest the english list ? 
  87 18:25 < h01ger> sepski, in german?
  88 18:25 < pere> h01ger: please add such comment to the release notes on the wiki.  I cut-n-paste that text when I make releases, and recommend others do the same. :)
  89 18:25 < sepski> h01ger, hopefully in english... :)
  90 18:25 < k4x> h01ger: hi fleissiger ;-)
  91 18:26 < pere> I believe the DVD is great at the moment, and that we should make a test04 release.  Anyone got time to do it?
  92 18:26 < pere> to do it, we need to update the release notes, copy the images and md5sum file, and send the email with the release notes.
  93 18:26 < h01ger> sepski, i believe some people are "afraid/uncomfortable" writing english. reading is fine, but writing. i keep telling "dont worry, we speak all english horrible" ;) 
  94 18:26 < pere> (I guess we should document the release process?)
  95 18:26 < sepski> is there any documentation on "how to make a test release" ? 
  96 18:26 < h01ger> pere, yes!
  97 18:27  * sepski have no clue to the process personaly
  98 18:27 < pere> sepski: didn't you make a release earlier?
  99 18:27 < sepski> never
 100 18:27 -!- jever [foobar@pD9577095.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #debian-edu
 101 18:27  * h01ger would like to fix the cds before a release, fix as in make the three archs similar, the same
 102 18:27 < pere> sepski: we can try to do one this weekend?  you do, and I talk about it? :)
 103 18:27  * jever = Jürgen Leibner
 104 18:27 < sepski> yes
 105 18:27 < sepski> if you can tutor. i'll try to learn :)
 106 18:27 < h01ger> \o/
 107 18:28 < pere> the DVD is still filled with a lot of packages we do not install by default.  do we want to install more packages by default?
 108 18:28 < pere> our packages will approximately 2.2 GiB on the DVD, and the rest is filled with packages ordered using popcon.debian.org-data.
 109 18:28 < pere> s/will/fill/
 110 18:28 < k4x> pere: what about fail2ban? i use this here often in schools
 111 18:28 < sepski> pere, if they are needed yes, but not just for fun. since it might trigger a requirement to up the minimum partition sizes
 112 18:29 < pere> It would be great if we could create one DVD for both i386 and amd64, or one with i386 binary and source, to reduce the logistic load.
 113 18:29 < h01ger> how about calling the next release rc1, and planning rc2, rc3 and then release for real?
 114 18:29 < pere> k4x: it is a tool blocking IP addresses doing dictionary attacks on sshd.
 115 18:29 < h01ger> or test4, rc1, rc2, rc3, release
 116 18:30 < pere> h01ger: I suggest test4, rc1, rc2, ...
 117 18:30 < sepski> k4x, is it enough to just install that package? how hard it it to preseed it's configuration ? 
 118 18:30 < k4x> pere: yes, we use this here against automatic ssh attacks
 119 18:30 < Baby> pere: gnash is ready for a check and an upload when you want  to :)
 120 18:30 < pere> k4x: if it isn't Baby great.  lets discuss it after the meeting.
 121 18:30 < pere> gah.
 122 18:31 < k4x> sepski: just install, default nothing to configure
 123 18:31 < danielsan> i think i386+amd64 would be grate, becouse the cd could than be source for an i386 ltsp on an amd64 server
 124 18:31 < pere> Baby: great.  lets discuss it after the meeting.
 125 18:31 < pere> k4x: if it isn't isn'stalled, it is probably a good idea to install it.
 126 18:31 < Baby> hatta go
 127 18:31 < Baby> cu!
 128 18:31 < Baby> :)
 129 18:31 < pere> Baby: need URL?
 130 18:31 < pere> do anyone know how to make i386+amd DVD?
 131 18:31 < Baby> i'll give it to you in private :)
 132 18:32 < pere> more on the DVD?
 133 18:32 < sepski> k4x, then it sounds all good. 
 134 18:32 < pere> I had a subtopic, User admin system? 
 135 18:32 < pere> h01ger: I noticed you made a decision today? :)
 136 18:33 < k4x> ;-)
 137 18:33 < danielsan> pere: i have planed to look at it after i've documented how to build cds/dvds local, but i can't promise to get something in the near feature :(
 138 18:33 < h01ger> pere, which one?
 139 18:33 < h01ger> pere, ah... 
 140 18:33 < sepski> lwat is the default since it's there. but if cipux get packages, we put them on the cd
 141 18:33 < h01ger> pere, cipux is not there, so we cannot release with it
 142 18:33 < h01ger> and if we want to release before the summer holidays... 
 143 18:33 < pere> I agree.  given the option between something present and working, and something missing and not working (yet), I pick the first one. :)
 144 18:34 < jever> danielsan: I'm looking forward to your docs ;-)
 145 18:34 < sepski> relese before summer is vital. :)
 146 18:34 < k4x> sepski: ack
 147 18:34 < pere> sepski: I agree.  I want it released before debconf, preferably in may.
 148 18:34 < sepski> k4x, can you add fail2ban or atleast write a bug about it. 
 149 18:34 < h01ger> danielsan, i'm looking forward for your docs too, but what do you need a local build for? maybe svn access would be more helpful? and upload rights as the 2nd step :)
 150 18:34 < pere> ok.  next topic?
 151 18:35 < h01ger> pere, yes, please
 152 18:35 -!- pere has changed the topic to Meeting in progress, topic: Status of the CD | agenda at http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/Meeting 
 153 18:35 < jever> h01ger: do you know how kubuntu builds their live and install dvd?
 154 18:35 < h01ger> jever, no. why?
 155 18:36 < sepski> the i386 netinstall is different from the others becouse i have been using it to try to make a working netinstall. 
 156 18:36 < jever> it seems to be the best in technical way what man could do someone told me 
 157 18:36 < pere> sepski: I believe I disabled your testing to get the CD to install.
 158 18:36 < danielsan> h01ger: with the read-access i have is ok at the moment, and i don't think i need commit rights until i've something useful
 159 18:37 < sepski> the cd did install as a netinstall, but you had to use the menu and do netcfg before profilechooser
 160 18:37 < pere> sepski: which is another way that it didn't install out of the box. :)
 161 18:37 < h01ger> jever, we dont have the manpower to do it and its planned for debian too. and we want to merge with debian, not with ubuntu...
 162 18:37 < sepski> as a netinstall no it did not. 
 163 18:37 < jever> h01ger: ok
 164 18:38 < pere> are anyone working on the CD installs?
 165 18:38 < h01ger> sepski, how much work is it to make the cds the same?
 166 18:38 < sepski> so if we depend on netcfg in d-e-i we'll get network before profilechooser
 167 18:38 -!- vagrantc [~vagrant@195.55.82.66] has quit [Quit: leaving]
 168 18:38  * h01ger thinks its perfectly fine if we define that the cds need network for proper installs. they are just too small.
 169 18:38 < pere> sepski: yes, but we do not want that question asked when installing from DVD.
 170 18:38 < sepski> h01ger, not very much, but im not 100% sure if we should make the ppc NETINST cd's or just turn back i386 to old style
 171 18:38 < h01ger> optional bonus points for a howto for setting up a local mirror from the dvd :)
 172 18:39 < pere> cp -r /media/dvd /var/www/dvd ?
 173 18:39 < sepski> pere, so we can not have netcfg before the profielchooser. and all the logic that tests for network in profilechooser is void since it will never ever be network at that time.
 174 18:39 < h01ger> pere, almost, yeah
 175 18:39 < pere> sepski: at least not on the DVD. :)
 176 18:40 < sepski> pere, if we want to change that. then we'd need 2 d-e-i-udebs with different depends lines
 177 18:40 < pere> hm.
 178 18:40 < sepski> i was hoping we could have netcfg later in the menu, and preseed it away if we are a dvd
 179 18:40 < pere> sepski: are you sure?  I suspect we could get away with it with two different exclude files and modifying the d-e-i-udeb menu item value to a value after netcfg.
 180 18:41 < pere> or letting profilechooser disable netcfg when the dvd is used. (just passing on random ideas. :)
 181 18:41 < sepski> that might work too
 182 18:41 < sepski> but it might bring out other questions that are later then d-e-i today and netcfg. 
 183 18:41 < pere> I suspect we want to have netcfg available on the DVD, but not activated by default.
 184 18:41 < sepski> but that can't be many
 185 18:42  * h01ger nods pere
 186 18:42 < pere> sepski: yes, it might, but I suspect there are no such question.
 187 18:42 < pere> but I ask again: Is there anyone working on the CD install?
 188 18:42  * h01ger is
 189 18:42 < sepski> i am when i have time
 190 18:42 < h01ger> but powerpc is different than i386
 191 18:42 < pere> ok.  good to know.
 192 18:42 < h01ger> thats why i want them to be the same
 193 18:42 < pere> h01ger: do powerpc use DVD?
 194 18:43 < h01ger> pere, yes. but i dont have one yet
 195 18:43 < h01ger> my imac is just half a year too old
 196 18:43 < h01ger> (to have one included)
 197 18:43 < h01ger> sepski, so will powerpc+amd64 become netinst or will i386 go back?
 198 18:43 < pere> I agree that all CDs should use the same (and working profile).  
 199 18:43 < sepski> if we want netcfg on the dvd there is realy no reason for the cd to be a NETINST anylonger
 200 18:44 < sepski> then we can put i386 back i belive
 201 18:44 < pere> how do we make it so?  do we want to use netinst or not?
 202 18:44  * h01ger thinks netinst is good. otherwise stuff will be missing from the cd, wont it?
 203 18:44 < h01ger> and we will have other problems then
 204 18:44  * pere have no idea what the netinst setting introduce.
 205 18:44 < h01ger> we should just leave/provide the proxy question...
 206 18:45 < sepski> I'll revert the i386. then we can work on adding netcfg globaly. 
 207 18:45 < h01ger> \o/
 208 18:45 < pere> ok.  15 minutes left.  lets move on.
 209 18:45 < sepski> pere, it does magic in .disk and includes some udebs
 210 18:45 < pere> sepski: right.  that make sense.
 211 18:45 -!- pere has changed the topic to Meeting in progress, topic: Status of debian-edu-doc | agenda at http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/Meeting
 212 18:46  * h01ger waves :)
 213 18:46 < pere> :)
 214 18:46 < h01ger> in the $svn/src/debian-edu-doc/todo i noted all i learned whats needed to make the package..
 215 18:46 < h01ger> feel free to edit & update..
 216 18:47 < h01ger> the main problem/issue, is that most of the docs is in a different svn repo that the package
 217 18:47 < h01ger> which we could tackle in three ways:
 218 18:47 < h01ger> 1. checkout from the other during build (anon checkout was broken, but thats a minor issue)
 219 18:48 < h01ger> 2. move the docs in the debian-edu svn on alioth
 220 18:48 < h01ger> 3. wget from the webserver
 221 18:48 < sepski> is there any reason they can not be on alioth ? 
 222 18:49 < h01ger> i prefer 2., because that way people wanting to work on the docs only need one svn account, on alioth
 223 18:49 < pere> sepski: the web pages on *skolelinux.* is updated from svn.skolelinux.no.
 224 18:49 < h01ger> pere, the webpages could be updated from alioth (or even the package) as well
 225 18:49 < h01ger> thats just the current implementation, but not a general problem
 226 18:49 < pere> I suspect this need to be discussed with the web people.  we want documentation on the web, and as a package making it locally available.
 227 18:50 < pere> it might make sense to move some documentation away from svn and into the wiki.
 228 18:50 < h01ger> arent the web people supposed to be here or read the list? 
 229 18:50 < sepski> it's a bad idea to move it, if it would alienate peaople that write docs now.
 230 18:50 < pere> not quite sure who the web people are.  any web people around?
 231 18:51 < pere> h01ger: there is some www related mailing list too.
 232 18:51 < h01ger> afaik klausade is the regular docu guy
 233 18:51 < h01ger> pere, oh, ic
 234 18:51 < k4x> pere: more wiki then web ;-)
 235 18:51 < h01ger> pere, norwegian or english?
 236 18:51 < pere> h01ger: both, I believe.  I do not subscribe, so I do not know.
 237 18:51 < h01ger> (list)
 238 18:51 < h01ger> hm. do you know where to subscribe?
 239 18:51 < pere> OleA_ is involved in documentation writing and web stuff I believe.  akai and Werner too.
 240 18:52  * h01ger isnt subscribed to enough mailinglists. HAHA 
 241 18:52 < h01ger> :)
 242 18:52 < pere> jemtland and jorgenhg used to be involved, perhaps they still are.
 243 18:52 < k4x> dave will work on doc too
 244 18:53 < h01ger> ok, i think i have a plan now. for the time being/for a start, i will checkout during build. but i will try to convince them to move to alioth, and update devl.s.no from there, its a simple fix, but in the long term its good, because then people only need one svn account.
 245 18:53 < pere> I believe it is a serious problem that the languages are not synchronized.  some doc is only in norwegian, some in german, some in english.
 246 18:53 < h01ger> and, the newdriftbook in svn is the sarge version anyway, we need to create a new branch anyway
 247 18:54 < h01ger> pere, this is the biggest argument *against* wikis.
 248 18:54 < pere> the norwegian itil doc should be translated to english, for example. :)
 249 18:54 < h01ger> and pro svn
 250 18:54 < pere> h01ger: perhaps.  what about using wikis, generate .po files from the docbook files, and then provide translations using the docbook and the po files?
 251 18:54 < k4x> h01ger: ;-)
 252 18:54 < h01ger> pere, no. the itil doc should be written in english and be translated to norwegian ;)
 253 18:55 < pere> h01ger: and I should have a time machine and live on a self sustainable colony on mars.  but while we wait for that, we are left with reallity.
 254 18:55 < h01ger> pere, keeping them in sync is the problem. current wikis provide no means for this, while its "easy" to build such a system with svn $id$s like debian-www uses
 255 18:55 < h01ger> pere, :))
 256 18:55 < k4x> pere: nice ;-)
 257 18:56 < h01ger> 4 mins left, next point?
 258 18:56  * pere try to leave the web and documentation stuff to people with more knowledge about it.
 259 18:56 -!- pere has changed the topic to Meeting in progress, topic: Release schedule - when do we want and plan to and can release? | agenda at http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/Meeting 
 260 18:57 < pere> I believe we should make the final release before debconf, preferably at the end of may.
 261 18:57 < h01ger> do you agree with my "we will fix p1+p2 bugs and then release" mail from today?
 262 18:57 < sepski> i think that was a good idea
 263 18:57 < h01ger> sepski, which one? 
 264 18:58 < pere> the DVD is great, and we will never be able to do everything we want.
 265 18:58 < sepski>  "we will fix p1+p2 bugs and then release"
 266 18:58 < pere> h01ger: in princible, yes.  I am not sure about the consequences, thought.
 267 18:58 < sepski> but i think we'r short on large scale testing,. i have not tested cups/samba/exim functionality at all
 268 18:58 < sepski> and we must ocourse upgrade bugs that are important to p1/2 
 269 18:59 < h01ger> pere, i believe we should be able to do this until debconf, or in a sprint at debcamp... there is also trondheim before debconf/camp...
 270 18:59 < pere> we need to prepare the release, have press releases ready, warn the person behind cd@skolelinux.org and in general get everyone to agree that now is the time to release.
 271 18:59 < h01ger> right
 272 18:59 < h01ger> all this in three weeks? :)
 273 18:59 < sepski> request funds from dunctank ? :) 
 274 19:00 < pere> h01ger: well, I believe we should release with what we got (fix a few issues, but not try to solve everything). :)
 275 19:00 < h01ger> pere, p1+p2 is four bugs :)
 276 19:00 < sepski> h01ger, 8 bugs on my list ? 
 277 19:00 < h01ger> i excluded all unconfirmed ones from the list :)
 278 19:00 < sepski> ahh
 279 19:01 < h01ger> hm, thats six, but still
 280 19:01 < pere> 6 p1 and p2 bugs.  and I suspect we can drop #1052, unless someone write replacement docs...
 281 19:01  * h01ger follows the link on the status of etch page
 282 19:02 < pere> and two of them are claimed to be fixed but need verification.
 283 19:02 -!- otavio [~otavio@201.40.162.47] has left #debian-edu []
 284 19:02 -!- schasi [~schasi@pD9E4EC26.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Verlassend]
 285 19:02 < h01ger> pere, verification should be easy..
 286 19:02 < pere> so, should we aim for a release at the end of may?
 287 19:02 < pere> and a new update release in august/september?
 288 19:02 < h01ger> pere, aim is fine, but i think we should go after p1+p2. we can always downgrade..
 289 19:03 < pere> h01ger: sure.  without aiming, there is no way to know if you hit or miss. :)
 290 19:03 < sepski> i think 1052 can be closed with a wontfix ? its doable, takes times. but gives us very little gain. 
 291 19:03  * h01ger wonders which welcome screen
 292 19:03 < h01ger> downgrade 1052 to p3?
 293 19:04 < pere> sepski: I agree.  it only make sense to me to fix it if we write our own text for F1-F10, and that is not going to happen any time soon.
 294 19:04 < pere> for example, the graphical installer is still using the default debian theme, and we are not going to fix that this time.
 295 19:04 < h01ger> isnt that just s/debian/debian-edu/? and rebuild the d-i...
 296 19:04 < sepski> h01ger, absoolutly
 297 19:04 < pere> so I do not see it as a big problem that it shows that we are using debian.
 298 19:05  * h01ger would like to use another theme, but not now...
 299 19:05 < sepski> especialy not since we want to be assimilated in the future
 300 19:05 < k4x> pere: ack
 301 19:05 < h01ger> :)
 302 19:05 < sepski> h01ger, and maintain d-i in out lcoal repo ? :)
 303 19:05 < pere> h01ger: not really.  we want to use the default d-i boot images, and debian-cd do not have hooks to edit the text included.
 304 19:05 < h01ger> sepski, details :)
 305 19:05 < h01ger> so wontfix
 306 19:05 < sepski> yes 
 307 19:06 < pere> at least I do not want to maintain d-i ourself again.  we did it for sarge, and it was a pain. :)
 308 19:06 < h01ger> theme is a different issue and imo would be worth rebuilding d-i. but probably better to tackle for lenny, so that different themes are supported without rebuilding
 309 19:06 < sepski> this should be solved by patches to d-i to give it support to override themeing at build
 310 19:07 < pere> h01ger: yeah, I suspect g-i will support theming without rebuilding for lennie.
 311 19:07  * h01ger would be happy if someone else wontfixes 1052, i have had enough bugzilla for the day :)
 312 19:07 < sepski> h01ger, ack i will. 
 313 19:07 < pere> ok.  we have a schedule.  last point.
 314 19:07 -!- pere has changed the topic to Meeting in progress, topic: Developer gathering in Trondheim | agenda at http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/Meeting 
 315 19:07  * pere can't make it.  :(
 316 19:08 < pere> who put this point on the agenda?  why?
 317 19:09 < h01ger> dunno. probably to convince pere to come ;)
 318 19:10 < h01ger> "We plan to release RC1 on May 19th, RC2 on May 26th, RC3 on June 2nd and Debian-Edu etch on June 9th." (and testrelease 4 on may 12th...) - is that a good plan?
 319 19:10  * pere is just too busy. :(
 320 19:10 < h01ger> pere, i understand... same here.. but i like traveling :)
 321 19:11 < pere> h01ger: cut rc2->rc3, and make rc2 the final cut. :)
 322 19:11 < pere> so, who are going to trondheim?
 323 19:11 < h01ger> you wish :) seriously, half an hour ago we discussed of planning 3 RC releases and i dont think more than one RC release per week is realistic...
 324 19:12 < pere> h01ger: I didn't notice the plan for 3 rc releases, but that is fine. :)
 325 19:12 < sepski> I am very likely to go. 
 326 19:12 < k4x> h01ger: wiki changelog says: holger has put this point?
 327 19:12 < sepski> k4x, yes :)
 328 19:13 < k4x> k4x: likes wikis ;-)
 329 19:13 < sepski> acording to  http://www.friprogramvareiskolen.no/Gathering/2007-06-Trondheim it's just me and h0lger. :)
 330 19:13 < h01ger> akai will also be there. great, more food for us. 
 331 19:13 < pere> two people going to trondheim.  it might end up like the first meeting in trondheim, with 7 people being incredibly productive. :)
 332 19:13 < k4x> ;-))
 333 19:14 < pere> small meetings tend to be very productive, if the right people are present. :)
 334 19:14  * h01ger hopes Werner will be around too
 335 19:14 < sepski> if the meeting is held in trondheim. wont some local people be there ? 
 336 19:15 < pere> sepski: I would expect so.   so akai will be there. :)
 337 19:15 < sepski> at least we can go find him if he dosn't :)
 338 19:15  * pere is not sure where everyone is located. :)
 339 19:15 < k4x> pere: i am here now ;-)
 340 19:15 < pere> ok.  next meeting? :)
 341 19:15 < h01ger> pere, can you send a mail the next week whats needs to be done for the release, like press releases, etc... 
 342 19:16 < pere> h01ger:  wont it be in the summary?
 343 19:16 < h01ger> (what you said above)
 344 19:16 < pere> which is posted to the list?
 345 19:16 < h01ger> pere, i think a dedicated mail is better. this needs some serious work
 346 19:16 < pere> I'll try to get it done.
 347 19:16 < pere> next meeting?
 348 19:16 < h01ger> might even be worth a p1 bug :)
 349 19:16 < sepski> meeting in a week (if we are going to have a change to release in 3w)
 350 19:16 < h01ger> in a week?
 351 19:16 < pere> I agree.
 352 19:17 < pere> but that is the norwegian national holiday.
 353 19:17 < h01ger> :)
 354 19:17 < pere> I suggest sunday 20th
 355 19:17 < h01ger> hmm
 356 19:17 < h01ger> a sec
 357 19:17 < pere> I'm vacating 16-20, and will be back 20th.
 358 19:18  * h01ger is fine with 20th
 359 19:18 < sepski> i think im good too
 360 19:18 < pere> same time?
 361 19:18 < pere> 18:00 UTC?
 362 19:19 < sepski> optimal for me
 363 19:19 < h01ger> fine with me
 364 19:19 < h01ger> but then, why not monday? 21st
 365 19:19 < h01ger> i'm just thinking that i tend to like to have free sundays and esp. free sunday evenings
 366 19:19  * pere is busy monday 21th.
 367 19:19 < h01ger> ah
 368 19:20 < pere> h01ger: isn't skolelinux done in your free time. :)
 369 19:20 < h01ger> we could also ask the list: sunday or tuesday, 18utc or 19utc, though on sunday i defintly prefer 18
 370 19:20 < h01ger> pere, it should ;)
 371 19:20  * pere might not be online 18th and 19th. :)
 372 19:20 < h01ger> and believe it or not, sometimes i do other stuff in my free time too :)
 373 19:21 < h01ger> 18 or 19 _utc_
 374 19:21 < pere> ah, right. :)
 375 19:21 < pere> who ask the list?
 376 19:21 < h01ger> so, sunday at 18 utc or tuesday at 19 utc? and what pere said :)
 377 19:22 < pere> ok.  lets close this meeting. :)
 378 19:22  * h01ger will ask the list then
 379 19:22 < pere> thank you all for showing up.  :)
 380 19:22 < k4x> tnx to all
 381 19:22 < h01ger> yup :)