1 21:03 < jemtland> when is the meeting, wasn't it now ?
2 21:03 < white> jip
3 21:04 < jemtland> ok, so it's us two ;)
4 21:04 < white> jemtland: well you can tell me about the wiki changes if you are interested :)
5 21:04 < white> jemtland: and i can tell you about Debian-Edu/Skolelinux 3.0 :)
6 21:05 < jemtland> Great. :) I'll go fetch a beer first... Back in a sec-
7 21:05 < white> kk
8 21:06 < jemtland> So, what is the status with the cd building process?
9 21:07 < white> they are currently building :)
10 21:07 < white> no space left :)
11 21:08 < white> hehe i am always running out of space
12 21:08 < jemtland> ok, is that on admin ?
13 21:08 < white> jemtland: i will test the etch based daily build later and see where it is
14 21:08 < white> jemtland: yes
15 21:08 < white> jemtland: but now we are using the old structure
16 21:08 < white> i talked to joey
17 21:08 < white> he has no time atm but i can ask him
18 21:08 < white> and as far as i can see the building process is working now
19 21:09 < white> have to test one or two things in productive but it seems to run
20 21:09 < jemtland> Great :)
21 21:09 < white> and i am working in svn now so everyone can join me :)
22 21:09 < jemtland> Good work, Steffen
23 21:10 < jemtland> is that on the new maintainer ?
24 21:10 < white> jemtland: well narvik and oslo was a good motivation
25 21:10 < white> jemtland: no i am working on administrator
26 21:10 < white> jemtland: and i think the svn is still on developer
27 21:10 < white> but will be moved to administrator
28 21:11 < jemtland> ok. G
29 21:11 < jemtland> Was'nt pere talking about a problem moving the svn to administrator ?
30 21:11 < white> jemtland: don't know
31 21:11 < jemtland> administrator do have limited access, and then we have quite number of contributors that can't commit.
32 21:12 < white> jemtland: no everybody can commit
33 21:12 < white> jemtland: we don't have svn limitation
34 21:12 < jemtland> ok, but not via ssh ...
35 21:12 < white> jemtland: don't know how it will be managed
36 21:12 < jemtland> ok.
37 21:12 < white> jemtland: but access shouldn't be a probelm
38 21:13 < white> everyone can also help with the cd without having access to administrator
39 21:13 < white> jemtland: ring of trust?
40 21:14 < white> jemtland: well do you have any further questiosn
41 21:14 < white> ?
42 21:14 < jemtland> no. Seems like the process is comming along quite good.
43 21:14 < white> slowly but yes :)
44 21:16 < jemtland> Shold I give a short status about the wiki ?
45 21:16 < white> jemtland: jip :)
46 21:16 < jemtland> sorry, plone to wiki convertion ....
47 21:16 < jemtland> As you can see on wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/PagesToMoveHere there is not that many pages left.
48 21:17 < jemtland> There are some HOWTOS, news, press, and some board stuff left.
49 21:17 < finnarne> jemtland: did you see my "wget --mirror" transformation of www.s.o/no ?
50 21:17 < white> but i read a lot of commits :)
51 21:17 < jemtland> Probably a couple of more evenings, the rest should be done.
52 21:18 < jemtland> finnarne: yes, I saw it. Seemd nice, to get rid of the "beast".....
53 21:18 * pere = Petter Reinholdtsen
54 21:18 < pere> sorry for being late. RL kept me occupied.
55 21:18 < white> pere: just a small meeting, jemtland moderates it :)
56 21:19 < pere> jemtland: when moving stuff away, do you remove it from plone and add a redirect in its place?
57 21:19 < jemtland> white: yes, the commits was for quite a lot of pages below help, production, and about.
58 21:19 < white> pere: sorry to be offtopic but i ran out of disk again :(
59 21:19 < pere> white: I'll fix it.
60 21:19 < white> jemtland: was motivating to read it :)
61 21:20 < white> pere: thanks :)
62 21:20 < jemtland> pere: I do not remov it, but add a rewrite rule.
63 21:20 < jemtland> The pages are possible to open, by oppening it with https instead of pure http.
64 21:21 < jemtland> The big problem, as far as I can see, is the not so nice structure on the wiki pages.
65 21:21 < pere> white: you have to move the bash shells away from the partition for me to resize it.
66 21:21 < jemtland> A lot of pages has been added directly to the DebianEdu root.
67 21:22 < white> pere: i am not logged in
68 21:22 < pere> white: builder is.
69 21:22 < pere> jemtland: well, isn't wiki pages easy to move?
70 21:22 < jemtland> I will add a sub (dir) page, named FrontpageProposals, where I will try to create a couple of proposals on how I think the frontpage should look.
71 21:22 < white> pere: well i logged out :(
72 21:22 < white> pere: maybe because i timed out
73 21:22 < pere> white: ok. I killed them.
74 21:23 < jemtland> pere: yes, they are, but nobody dere to move something that others have created :)
75 21:23 < jemtland> s/dere/dare/
76 21:23 < white> jemtland: well maybe just move
77 21:23 < white> jemtland: someone might stand up and cry if it is not ok
78 21:24 < white> but i would just move iot
79 21:24 < jemtland> I have sendt a proposal on how to clean up the pages to www-int, not mutch of a respons... I will do one more note about it, and then just do it :=
80 21:24 < white> jemtland: btw was there a meeting about the international wiki stuff?
81 21:24 < white> xorAxAx: ping
82 21:25 < white> i haven't read follow ups on www-int
83 21:25 < xorAxAx> pong
84 21:25 < jemtland> white: yes, but it was mostly about how to cooperate between the wiki's
85 21:25 < xorAxAx> i havent seen the mail at all
86 21:25 < white> i got just 2 mails except the bugzilla list stuff on www-int
87 21:25 < white> during the last month
88 21:26 < jemtland> I sendt a mail
89 21:26 < jemtland> 2006-03-25T17:26:30
90 21:26 < white> just want to ask if something blocks the teams
91 21:26 < jemtland> with the subject [slx-www-int] Some clean up on the wiki pages
92 21:26 < white> jemtland: yes i got your mail
93 21:26 < white> and one from xorAxAx and one from another guy asking something
94 21:26 < jemtland> I also cc'ed it to debian-edu list....
95 21:26 < pere> jemtland: sounds good to me. just organise the pages to make it look good. I notice several howtos being moved without any protests. I'm sure it will b
96 e ok.
97 21:27 < pere> jemtland: are you moving the norwegian pages as well?
98 21:27 < white> jemtland: i think you can feel free to decide about the structure
99 21:27 < white> jemtland: so maybe just do it and then see if someone cries :)
100 21:27 < jemtland> Yes. As I seed I'll send a note about it, and start cleaning :)
101 21:27 < jemtland> Any more questions about the wiki stuff ?
102 21:27 < xorAxAx> jemtland: ah, i followed up on that one, didnt i?
103 21:27 < jemtland> xorAxAx: yes, you did :)
104 21:28 < pere> jemtland: yes. where should norwegian pages be stored? The ITIL documents should probably end up in some wiki, but where?
105 21:29 < jemtland> pere: Good question. I think we have three alternatives:
106 21:29 < jemtland> 1.) set up one our self, here in Norway
107 21:29 < white> pere: can i continue on adminstrator? i see you already expanded it
108 21:29 < jemtland> 2.) ask someone to host a brand new one for use,
109 21:29 < pere> white: yes.
110 21:30 < jemtland> 2. b) Use an existing one. Feks. wiki.debian.org
111 21:30 < pere> jemtland: well, given the current state of server maintainence, I recommend 2b. :)
112 21:30 < jemtland> the first one, we need to administer our self... Do we have manpowers for that....
113 21:31 < pere> jemtland: only if _required_, aka no other alternative is usable.
114 21:31 < jemtland> pere: Yes, I to, but its not the newest moinmoin version...
115 21:31 < white> did somebody write a mail to the wiki admins and complained about the version?
116 21:31 < pere> I would rather move more services into the debian infrastructure, instead of creating more services we need to maintain ourselves.
117 21:31 < jemtland> well, we could ask the germans to host a wiki for us, that would be 2.)
118 21:31 < white> pere: ack
119 21:31 * pere have not asked the wiki admins to upgrade.
120 21:32 < pere> there are three existing wikis assosiated with the project, as far as I know. wiki.debian.org, wiki.skolelinux.de and wiki.skolelinux.fr.
121 21:32 < jemtland> Werner, was watching a thread about a wiki diskussion, and he was waiting for the right moment to tell them that we also wanted to get it upgraded.
122 21:33 < jemtland> pere: as fare as I know, I also think that is correct.
123 21:35 < jemtland> I think a wiki.debian.org/DebianEduNo or similar should be a good place to have the Norwegian wiki. Then there can also be created a DebianEduEs for
124 the spanish people.... or others..
125 21:35 < pere> jemtland: the thread was probably <URL:http://lists.debian.org/debian-project/2006/04/msg00288.html>.
126 21:35 < white> we need to save manpower otherwise we are lost
127 21:36 < pere> if wiki.debian.org can't be used, I suggest we redirect wiki.skolelinux.org to either of the other wikis, and ask them to set up a new wiki domain for it
129 21:37 < white> pere: but if we have problems with debian wiki we should complain about it to improve it first
130 21:37 < jemtland> Just as a side note, the commits messages from the wiki is now a result of the following regexp "DebianEdu.*".
131 21:37 < jemtland> I don't see that many problems in using wiki.debian.org.
132 21:38 < pere> lets try that then, and ask to have it upgraded if required. what is the problem with the current version? Should we make a wiki page explaining the pr
133 oblems and documenting which version will fix them?
134 21:39 < jemtland> I have only noticed the missing feature that Knuty and you was talking about in Narvik, about the missing convertion possibilityes.
135 21:40 < pere> jemtland: well, that seem to be missing on wiki.skolelinux.de too, so I am not sure it exist a version with that support. :)
136 21:41 < jemtland> ok, I'll try to get the rest of the people on www-no to agree on moving pages to the wiki, and as you seed, well make a wiki pages, with wath we miss
137 of features.....
138 21:41 < jemtland> Any more questions about the wiki stuff ?
139 21:42 < jemtland> it moved into a Norwegian orientaited direction, but I hope everyone apologies that ;)
140 21:42 < jemtland> Next item on the list, was more of a question of mine...
141 21:42 < white> jemtland: sure as i am an half norwegian :)
142 21:43 < pere> as for the problem of moving svn away from developer, it need to move into an environment where all the user can ssh in, and administrator is not such en
144 21:43 < jemtland> I was playing with a script for making graphs about gnupg trusted signatures, and it hit me that the "ring" of trust of the skolelinux people wasnt t
145 hat obvius....
146 21:43 < jemtland> pere: right, white and I was talking about that before you came.
147 21:43 < white> jemtland: what do you mean with "ring" ?
148 21:44 < jemtland> Do you know the status of the installatin of the new maintainer...
149 21:44 < pere> jemtland: yes, quite a few contributors are missing gpg keys, and those that do lack signatures.
150 21:44 < white> pere: can't we use maintainer or user?
151 21:44 < pere> white: we probably can.
152 21:44 < jemtland> white: I'll explain in a bit... We'll take that after the server discussion, if that is ok for you.
153 21:44 < pere> jemtland: it is mounted in the rack, not powered on and thus not installed.
154 21:44 < white> pere: so the svn should be on the project's login server
155 21:45 < white> jemtland: sure
156 21:45 < pere> jemtland: Werner plan to start installation tomorrow, when the machine room opens again.
157 21:45 < jemtland> I think werner is waiting for a cd from me... Those servers have a management chip. And he need a spcecial cd to change the management ip adr.
158 21:46 < pere> jemtland: yes, but that is not blocking the installation of debian/sarge. it will be nice to have when the server is in production, though.
159 21:46 < jemtland> If the ip is'nt changed, the server "occpies" two adresses.
160 21:47 < jemtland> , and I also think it is doing some kind of broadcast to the net the management adr. is in.....
161 21:47 < jemtland> I'll try to rip the cd first thin in the morning... Could'nt find it on www.intel.com
162 21:48 < jemtland> ok, pere anything else regarding the upgrade of the servers ?
163 21:48 < pere> I suspect ftp.skolelinux.no is ready to move to ftpnew.s.n, but someone should compare the file lists on the two ftp sites, to see what might be missing.
164 21:48 < white> pere: the isos :)
165 21:48 < pere> there are a lot of services left on administrator, for example popcon, cd builds, etc.
166 21:49 < white> pere: but i can probably fix that
167 21:49 < pere> white: the isos are moved.
168 21:49 < white> pere: i mean the new daily builds
169 21:49 < pere> the cd archive, that is.
170 21:49 < white> pere: where to store the new daily builds?
171 21:49 < pere> white: well, we want new daily builds, so that is not part of the files to move.
172 21:49 < pere> white: same location as earlier? ~ftp/cd-*/
173 21:49 < white> pere: ok
174 21:50 < white> pere: ok and official releases under skolelinux-cd or debian-edu-cd
175 21:50 * pere believe we should change as little as possible while moving, to avoid generating more work than we have to.
176 21:50 < white> and the rest under szute name seems to be good :)
177 21:51 < white> s/szute/suites/
178 21:51 < jemtland> ok. should we move on to the gpg stuff ?
179 21:51 < white> pere: do we have enough disk space left for the four daily builds?
180 21:52 < white> pere: under /var/www/ftp.skolelinux.org/...
181 21:52 < white> jemtland: sorry this last question :)
182 21:52 < pere> white: yes.we have ~220 GiB unused space on LVM.
183 21:52 < jemtland> white: np :)
184 21:53 < white> pere: didn't saw it :)
185 21:53 < white> jemtland: ok gpg stuff :)
186 21:53 * pere is considering upgrading the kernel on a.s.n, to get one > 2.6.10 and thus with online resizing support. that way we can extend file systems without umo
187 unting and thus do it on the fly while services are running.
188 21:54 < white> pere: well it seems that we need to resize very often :)
189 21:54 < pere> white: yes, and as shrinking is harder, I prefer to extend often than to run out of space because we gave too much space where it wasn't needed.
190 21:55 < white> pere: no problem :)
191 21:55 < pere> jemtland: gpg stuff?
192 21:55 < jemtland> I'm not that knowleged in the feld of gpg signatures, and stuff. So today I played with trustgraph.sh. This gave me www.jemtland.com/fyj.ps.
193 21:56 * pere have started using kgpg, which gave me a good view on my keyring.
194 21:56 < jemtland> Here I was baffeled that the skolelinux people wasn't more dominant.....
195 21:56 < jemtland> pere: the discussion you and finnarne had, gave me the urge to look into this :)
196 21:58 < jemtland> But the picture that kgpg givs me looks nicer thant the picture I got from the trustgraph script. There I saw that feks. that pere trusts med, but I
197 dosnt seem to trust pere .... As far as i could read the graph....
198 21:59 < pere> kgpg can produce graphs?
199 21:59 < jemtland> And so I was thinking that we should realy focus on getting more knowlage about this stuff into the project....
200 21:59 < white> jemtland: do you trust me btw?
201 21:59 < white> jemtland: we did keysigning
202 21:59 < pere> jemtland: but yes, we need to get more of the skolelinux people to care for gpg.
203 21:59 < white> jemtland: you haven't sent me your sig
204 21:59 < white> jemtland: and we did it a long time ago
205 21:59 < jemtland> pere: no, but trustgraph.sh is a 4 liner script that maks the graph. It was prety cool ....
206 21:59 < white> jemtland: aaaaaaaaah very important
207 22:00 < pere> jemtland: how did you select keys?
208 22:00 < jemtland> white: look for your self ;) - http://www.jemtland.com/fyj.ps
209 22:01 < white> jemtland: yes i have signed you but you haven't sign me
210 22:01 < jemtland> pere: the scipt runed a gpg --list-sig, and did some magic...
211 22:02 < jemtland> white: nope, there you see.... /me is wondering what i have done wrong.... Will look into it, now after the meeting...
212 22:02 -!- klausade
213 22:03 < white> jemtland: goodie ;)
214 22:03 < jemtland> But the gpg was more of a side note..... I think we have used up our time for now. Anyting else we should look into ?
215 22:03 < jemtland> Date for the next meeint ?
216 22:03 < pere> jemtland: I guess we should use the user list on developer.s.n, and look for gpg keys for them on the keyserver.
217 22:04 < jemtland> pere: good suggestion....
218 22:04 * pere is in for a busy may, and might not make it to the next meeting.
219 22:04 < white> yes and we should keep in mind that gpg keys are now more important for instance for local packages
220 22:04 < jemtland> I also think we should tell people witch people they are missing the signed keys from... Then we can give people a list to "hunt" afte :)
221 22:05 < jemtland> I'll do that for my self, and I'll send a mail about it to the list...
222 22:05 < jemtland> Should the next meeding be in a month ?
223 22:05 < jemtland> Any suggestions ?
224 22:06 < pere> jemtland: I expect to be less busy around the start of july, so I do not believe you should wait for me. :)
225 22:07 < jemtland> ok. I have no clue what I'm doing in a month, but I propose the 29.th of may....
226 22:07 < finnarne> I think we agreed at some point that the we should switch to a 4 week interval
227 22:08 < white> sounds good
228 22:08 < jemtland> finnarne: :) Then we settel for the 29. Time ?
229 22:08 < jemtland> same as this one ?
230 22:08 < finnarne> It's almost summer then, lets take it 20:00 GMT
231 22:08 < pere> finnarne: 22:00 norwegian time. a bit late, perhaps?
232 22:09 < jemtland> I also find that a bit late....
233 22:09 < finnarne> ok, it was just a suggestion :)
234 22:09 < jemtland> :)
235 22:09 < jemtland> ok, 19:00 GMT the 29th of may?
236 22:10 < finnarne> I dont take part of this meeting anyway, so dont mind me :)
237 22:10 * pere might be available, do not know.
238 22:10 < white> jemtland: sounds good
239 22:10 < jemtland> Then I'll "step down of the chair" thank you all. If everyone attended could do a /me == full name. well wrap this up.
240 22:10 < pere> finnarne: hehe. just sitting in a corner chatting. :)
241 22:10 * jemtland == Frode Jemtland
242 22:11 < finnarne> minding my own business
243 22:11 * finnarne was not here :)
244 22:11 * white == Steffen Joeris
245 22:11 < jemtland> finnarne: ok, I'll do a grep -v finnarne :)
246 22:11 [Users #debian-edu]
247 22:11 [ [-oskar-] ] [ ettin ] [ Idefix__] [ Oggis ] [ svenl_ ] [ white ]
248 22:11 [ aurel32 ] [ finnarne] [ jakobbg ] [ OleA ] [ Svenna ] [ xorAxAx ]
249 22:11 [ Barbarossa] [ Foley ] [ jarlev ] [ pere ] [ TiaZzz ] [ xzz ]
250 22:11 [ bip ] [ Foley_ ] [ jemtland] [ pere_away ] [ Tolimar ] [ Zero_Dogg]
251 22:11 [ bjoernen ] [ Foley__ ] [ jorgenhg] [ sander ] [ toresbe ] [ |Terje| ]
252 22:11 [ Bman^ ] [ Gagatan ] [ k4x ] [ sep ] [ trippeh ]
253 22:11 [ davewatson] [ h01ger ] [ laprag ] [ stockholm_] [ trondm_gone]
254 22:11 [ Dr3as ] [ hermanr_] [ markos_ ] [ sunny256 ] [ Werner ]
255 22:11 -!- Irssi:
256 22:12 < finnarne> good.
257 22:12 -!- klausade
258 22:12 < jemtland> there is now 45 nicks present
259 22:12 < pere> 46. :)
260 22:12 < jemtland> obs now it was 46...